If Wagensveld meant that all Muslims were Nazis, he would of course be wrong, but even that wouldn’t justify this sentence. Not even all Germans were Nazis. But increasingly in the West, noting that there is any problem at all with jihad or Sharia is becoming criminalized.
“Pegida frontman gets suspended sentence for comparing Muslims to Nazis,” NL Times, August 6, 2024:
The court of appeals in The Hague has sentenced Pegida frontman Edwin Wagensveld to a conditionally suspended community service of 40 hours for group insult. The frontman for the radical far-right group had compared Muslims to Nazis. He was not present at the court on Tuesday.
“With his comments, the suspect has hurt a large group of people willingly,” said the chair of the court. “There is no place in our society for this where freedom of religion and equality are among the most important core values.”
The court sentenced Wagensveld (56) to 40 hours of community service last year, and a fine was also issued. This was due to an incident on 22 January 2023 near the Tweede Kamer, the lower house of the Dutch parliament. He tore a Quran before a camera and jumped on the ripped pages. During the appeal hearing last month, Wagensveld said that his Nazi comparison was only referring to Salafists, the fundamentalist movement within Islam that takes the Koran literally.
Purposely insulting a group of people for their religion or faith is punishable by law. Ripping up a Quran does not fall under this, as it is seen as a criticism of faith….
mgoldberg says
And all the fine muslim and leftist folks who have accused Israel of being Nazi’s, of being genocidists, who walk the halls of the UN and the ICJ, and the Human Rights Commisision who peddle such utterly false factual declarations, why they surely have received such sentences too…. right???
Am I wrong ? says
The Nazis were fascists right, that’s not in question an English dictionary say’s Fascism is characterized by dictatorial power, FORCIBLE SUPPRESSION OF OPPOSITION sounds to me like Islam if you look at Nigerian muslims and those in Mali not to mention the evil acts being carried out in Bangladesh.
JS says
No need to go there, it’s in every Western nation. If one hasn’t seen it then they haven’t been paying attention.
Jedothek says
There are many things wrong with the sentence on Wagensveld. here’s one. Since Islam contains both (what we would classify as) religious and political elements, to deem that the whole religion is protected by a law against insulting religion means that one cannot in practice criticize the political elements in Islam — and i thought that in free countries protecting discourse on political issues was essential.
࿗Infidel࿘ says
But in Europe – including in the Netherlands – people routinely criticize and mock Christianity, and if I’m not mistaken, Judaism too. In other words, religion doesn’t have a special shield under which it cannot be criticized
From what I see, this court was simply too scared to let him walk. Or alternatively, decided to imprison him for his own protection, which is another disturbing trend worldwide on the ways to deal w/ mob rule
somehistory says
This man telling the Truth, without making threats of murder, gets sentenced. The ghoul in the U.K., saying the nazi thing of those opposed to the onslaught of mozlums into the country and saying how each one who is opposing the masses coming in should ‘have their throat cut’…and nothing happens to him
More and more evil; less and less Truth, is allowed.
“freedom of religion and equality” There is none in so very many places. The nations are giving mozlums the freedom, and no other group is “equal.”
Even the guy in Japan keeping the Israeli out while welcoming the ghoul from iran in *celebration*? of the WWII bombing.
Captain Quirk says
If you ask me, his defence was lacking. He should have quoted surah’s 47-4 and 2-191 (a.o.), stated that they both are Medinan surah’s, explain why that’s important (abrogation) and explain that the kor’an has to be read literally (end of the Idjtihad) and what the punishment is for not doing so (a ‘decap’, so to speak). But I don’t blame him. He may know these things (but then again, he may not), but most attorneys don’t (if he made use of an attorney at all).
࿗Infidel࿘ says
Can’t Geert Wilders, who has law enforcement in this government, intervene and note that he was expressing his opinion? Not sure what the law is in the Netherlands, but do they have freedom of expression or not? I happen to think Mr Wagensveld is correct, but even if he wasn’t, what he said definitely doesn’t warrant jail time
Guus Geluk says
No, he can’t. The Dutch minister of Justice can not intervene in the decision who to prosecute for what; that decision is entirely and solely up to the Dutch ‘d.a.’.
As of late, I have become more interested in the wording of article 1 of the Dutch ‘Ground law’, the ‘Grondwet’, our ‘Constitution’. Insofar as relevant, the second sentence of article 1 reads:
‘Discriminatie wegens godsdienst, levensovertuiging, politieke gezindheid (…) is niet toegestaan.’ Thgis translates into: ‘Discrimination because of religion, belief (‘philosophy of life’), political affiliation (…) is not permitted.’ Now, everybody always talks about discrimination because of religion, but that discussion is not too difficult. Not even in the light of article 1, because generally worded invective such as ‘Kill them wherever you find them’ (surah 2: 191)and ‘Strike their necks’ (surah 47, 4) that one is obliged to take literallly constitutes a breach of article 7 of that same Constitution, to wit: the freedom of expression. Why? Because that freedom is limited with the expression ‘(…) behoudens ieders verantwoordelijkheid voor de wet.’ Literally translated: except for everyone’s liability before the law’, ‘the law’ comprising the Dutch criminal code, which forbids incitement to violence. Not that our current elite cares, or – perhaps more preciselly – knows about these surah’s, but that should play out easily in a court of law.
What I’m more interested in is the guarantee of freedom of belief (‘philosophy of life’) and political affiliation. Now several prominent leftist politicians have openly rejected cooperation with the PVV, basically stating that this is an abject party with abject ideas/ an abject programme. And if you ask me, this constitutes a breach of article 1 on the basis of the freedom of belief and of political affiliation.
Now, I’m not too sure about the choice of words of Mr. Wagensveld. He may need some training in that respect, in view of the clause ‘except for everyone’s liability before the law’. But if he stays within the limits emanating from this limitation, he has a superb case claiming discrimination on the basis of his constitutionally guaranteed freedom of belief (‘philosophy of life’) and of political affiliation.
In summary: this debate has only just begun.
࿗Infidel࿘ says
Guus
Thank you for that information
Pray Hard says
He was incorrect in a sense. Moslems are much worse than Nazis.
JS says
Yep! And that’s lost on too many that think they’re just after Jews! Just wondering how much evidence DO THEY NEED?
JS says
Agreed! They want to eliminate all infidels and anyone else they don’t like, including each other.
Nabil Bissada says
In the real Muslims who are practicing Islam are worse than the Nazis.
Muslims their Nazis character is coming for practicing Islam for more than 1450 years.
The only way for Muslims to be away from the Nazis, are to quit Islam religion.
Sheikh Yassin a Muslim Imam. was a close friend to Hitler. He gave him the idea to do the Holocaust who killed over than 8 million Jewish.
Same as Muhammed the prophet of Islam did with Bany Korayza when he beheaded over than 900 Jewish by his own sword.
The instructions of the Koran and the sharia law are worse than the instructions of the Nazis.
For that Muslims do not escape from their Islamic to any Muslims countries they escape to the western countries.
Again, Yes Muslims who are practicing Islam are worse than the Nazis.
For more information:
http://www.Jihadwatch.org
http://www.answering-islam .org
Box of Islam by Hamed Abdel Sammad
Brother Rashid
El Fady T.V. (Pastor Father Dr. Zakaria Boutros)
.
Troybeam says
Hitler and the Muslims, WW2 get together with photo history for proof, Islam loves Hitler because he built the camps and murdered millions of the Jewish people and any people he deemed inferior to the white race all the while wanting a perfect white race to exist….”Boys From Brazil” movie.
Lizabee says
One thing I’ve learned from Jihad watch is to never visit Europe, Canada, NZ or Australia…I wouldn’t feel safe from either the jihad Nazis or the Governmental Nazis.
In my lifetime I have seen what was once considered the “Free World” shrink and hanging by a thread.
Same thing will happen in America if Democrat NaziCommies stay in control.
brenrod says
If the Koran tells Muslims to kill Jews isn’t that comparable to nazism. What is wrong with tearing such a book to pieces? Please explain, Holland,
jerry glenn says
Netherlands surges in the international Islamopandering derby.
OLD GUY says
Freedom of speech, Islam can call for killing all jews and non-muslims and thats ok. Non islamic person calls out the truth about islam and they get punished for the truth.
Scotsman48 says
islamism is the new nazism.