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Turkey vows to back Sweden in NATO, if the EU accepts Turkey as a member

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It was a big mistake to allow Turkey to be part of NATO in the first place. Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan’s goal is to revive of the Ottoman Empire (a global caliphate); he continues to manipulate NATO to that end, and is now employing this new tactic to move closer to his goal.

Erdogan has already declared that Turkey has nothing that contradicts Taliban beliefs; the mainstream media all over the West ignored this important declaration.

“Erdoğan: Ankara could approve Sweden’s NATO bid if EU ‘opens way’ to Turkey,” Euronews, July 10, 2023:

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan says his country could approve Sweden’s membership in NATO if European nations “open the way” to Turkey’s bid to join the European Union.

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan says Ankara could approve Sweden’s NATO membership if Europeans “open the way” to Turkey’s EU bid.

Erdoğan, whose country has been holding off its final approval of Sweden’s NATO membership, made the comments in Ankara on Monday before departing to the alliance’s summit meeting in Vilnius, Lithuania.

Turkey is a candidate to join the EU, but its membership bid has been stalled due to Ankara’s democratic backsliding and disputes with EU-member Cyprus…….

Comments

  1. “disputes with Cyprus” er, well, actually hostile invasion of Cyprus.

  2. I knew the crook would try to blackmail the EU. He wants to dump the worthless Turkish lira and pull a Greece with the Euro. To bad we do not have the CIA of the old days. Erdogan would have a zero altitude plane crash and a massive heart attack, making room for General Mustafa dolar için çalışacak to rule the country who will call democratic elections in 6 months time wink-wink.

  3. No, just no! And if Turkey remains difficult, let every other member of NATO file out of NATO and rejoin a new organization w/ identical goals, thereby re-creating NATO, but leaving Turkey out and alone. In fact, such an organization should even include Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Georgia & Armenia, and have in its charter the confrontation against both China and Turkey

    • Infidel, If Russia were part of NATO or some similar organization, it would just undermine it so it could invade and conquer its neighbors.

      • They wouldn’t be interested. Their moves on Georgia and later Ukraine started after NATO’s eastward expansion in the late 90s, in violation of a commitment made by James Baker to Mikhail Gorbachev. Otherwise, maintaining the other 14 republics was a drag on the RSFSR, & most Russians weren’t interested in keeping hold of those countries. On the current conflict, there are analysts who point out that if Russia reconquered Ukraine, that would be a drag on the Russian economy. Ukraine’s only importance to Russia is strategic: that it not be a NATO base that could be potentially used against Russia

        But yeah, it would have made sense to ethnically re-define the borders, so that things like Crimea, Artsakh/Nagorno Karabakh, Northern Kazakhstan, Samarqand, all could have been ethnically reassigned to the country that had the ethnic majorities there. A lot of people living in republics different from their own ethnicity had to relocate: at least that hardship could have been mitigated

        • Infidel–with all respect–do you *really* believe that Russia has only invaded Georgia, Ukraine, and eastern Moldova because defensive alliance NATO exists? Among the many excuses Putin has given for invading Ukraine are that Ukraine doesn’t exist (i.e., unless conquered by Russia) and that he is the new Peter the Great (that is, a conqueror).

          The Soviet Union and Russia have never attacked a NATO member, but plenty of countries that are *not* protected by NATO.

          How does the existence of a defensive alliance allow Russia to invade countries not protected by that alliance?

          And no–there was never an American agreement that no nations would be allowed to join NATO, and hence remain vulnerable for Russian invasion. For one thing, the United States doesn’t control NATO, and doesn’t solely control what nations may and may not join.

          Then, NATO has existed for almost three quarters of a century. It has never invaded Russia, nor ever threatened to do so. The idea that Ukraine or any other country must be sacrificed to Russian invasion is appalling.

          The Baltic States border with Russia, and have been NATO members for over 30 years. NATO has never threatened to attack Russia through Estonia, Latvia, or Lithuania.

          And would you also say that Finland should be kept vulnerable to Russian attack and not allowed to join NATO because they share a border with them?

          Then, most Ukrainians are ethnically similar to western Russians. This doesn’t mean that they ergo want to be invaded and murdered by Russians.

  4. If one nation refuses to vote in the affirmative, the admission of a new member is not permitted. Given Greece’s conflicts with Greece since before 1821 and the occupation of Greece by the Ottomans, I don’t see Turkey being granted permission. I don’t see the Balkan nations wanting to see the re-emergence of the Ottoman Empire either.

    • I just wish there was a mechanism to expel members, be it from the EU or Turkey. Then NATO could have kicked out Turkey, while admitting Sweden & Finland w/o that brouhaha over quran burnings

      • I agree with you here, Infidel. Having Turkey in NATO may have seemed like a good idea in 1952–now, not so much.

  5. If Ukraine joins NATO this will be the Casus Belli of WW3.It is a National security problem for Russia.
    They are quite clear they won’t permit that.This interconnection of alliances is a bite like before WW1:these leaders are not wise.Sweden should stay out of NATO but now they are set up for a confrontation with Russia.It will be the fault of the globalist elite and idiotic leaders.

    Who was it that said “We need to go to war Russia”?Hillary Clintton.

    man pokes a bear..and pokes..and pokes..and pokes the bear and then one day the bear lashes out.

    What would the Leftist biased MSM say?

    “Mad Russian bear goes on rampage killing completely innocent man”

    But who is poking the bear?NATO/west

    Meanwhile the zelensku road show continues ‘C’mon let’s do this.Lets’s start WW3.C’mon Russkies”
    it is not as if NATO/West are the ‘good guys’;nobody is.

    • FYI, Ukraine has never threatened Russia. Then, NATO has existed since 1949 and has never threatened Russia, nor the Soviet Union before that.

      Then, Russia is the only one threatening to nuke other nations–Ukraine is not doing this, nor are other Western nations.

      So what security problem does Russia have? It is just not able to invaded NATO nations. This is a security issue for Russia’s neighbors, not Russia itself.

      Then, Finland and Sweden only applied to join NATO after Russian invaded Ukraine because she *wasn’t* a NATO member. Russia has never attacked a NATO nation.

      So you are saying that Sweden has to leave herself open to Russian attack–why?

      I keep hearing that if a nation opposes the idea that Russia should be able to attack them that they are “poking the bear”. Were Czechoslovakia and Poland “poking” Germany when they disapproved of being invaded by Hitler?

      Then, the claim that President Zelensky in wanting invading Russians out of his nation is actually genocidally attacking Russians is entirely false.

      Finally, implying that you are equally a bad guy if you invade an unthreatening country or defend against that invasion is just wrong–this is false moral equivalency.

      • Gravenimage
        When the USSR collapsed in the early 90’s western leaders assured Gorbachev that no previous soviet country would ever be allowed to join NATO, and declassified documents prove this. NATO deceived Russia, Within a decade western leaders went back on their word and started to allow them to join.
        Here in the west we are led to believe that Putin is trying to re-establish the Soviet Union. But could the real reason be that he invaded Ukraine was to protect his borders against NATO expansion. Think about it.

        • John, I have never found any evidence that NATO agreed to sacrifice all former Iron Curtain countries to Russian conquest, despite claims to this effect.

          Then, former Iron Curtain nations have been members of NATO for over 30 years now, so to claim that Ukraine–which was not poised to join NATO, in any case–was somehow a threat to Russia’s borders, when the Baltic States neve were, makes no sense.

        • Gravenimage
          Unfortunately I still don’t know how to share a link here, I will have to get someone to show me, but if you type in the following—-
          NATO Expansion what Gorbachev heard.
          If you’ve found the right article, you will see a black and white photograph of Gorbachev sitting down with a crowd of people standing round him.
          The article explains thoroughly how western leaders misled Gorbachev. It even has many of the declassified documents ( which I haven’t read) after the article.

        • John,

          this may be the link you wanted to share

          https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/briefing-book/russia-programs/2017-12-12/nato-expansion-what-gorbachev-heard-western-leaders-early

          When you wish to share a link, you go to the site which you wish to share. While on the page, you click on the url…https…etc.
          and then press the ctrl key along with the c key. this will copy the url address.
          Then, come back to this site to the page where you wish to post the link, ctrl and the v key. That will post the link.

        • Gravenimage and Somehistory.
          The link is above that I was unable to post. Thank you for doing that Somehistory.

      • Secretary of State James Baker 1990, reassured Gorbachev with this famous quote, “Not one inch eastward.”

        • Gravenimage
          Correct it was during the unification of Germany but, “Not one inch eastward” was about NATO expansion. Incidentally he said this three times to Gorbachev, not just the once.

        • Thanks for that link, Somehistory and John. Despite the claim, this does seem to have been about East Germany. The idea that the US had either the power or the inclination to prevent any Iron Curtain nation to join NATO–and hence be forever subject to the specter of being reinvaded by Russia at any point–is not plausible.

          Ukraine not being a NATO member is why Russia thought it could easily get away with invading her.

        • John–with all respect–NATO has never threatened Russia. Then, Ukraine was not poised to join NATO in any case. And your idea that Russia has only invaded nations due to the existence of NATO is mistaken. The Soviet Union grabbed most of eastern Europe, and they did this before NATO existed.

        • Gravenimage
          I’ve never said that “Russia has only invaded nations due to the existence of NATO.” As it’s a well known fact that Russia has been extremely imperialistic and belligerent, and has invaded many nations.
          You also say that, “NATO has never threatened Russia,” well maybe verbally they haven’t. But in the early sixties, NATO deployed, US made nuclear missiles in Turkey in the direction of Russia. If that was not a threat then I don’t know what is. Khrushchev responded by deploying nuclear missiles in Cuba. Well Kennedy wasn’t having that, and the rest is history. A similar sort of thing is going on today. The US deploys troops in Taiwan, now China intends to build a military base in Cuba.
          However we can agree on one thing, and that is, Putin should never of invaded the Ukraine. Many believe his reason for doing this was an attempt to re-establish the USSR, while others believe he sees NATO as the enemy and doesn’t want them encroaching anymore on Russia’s borders. Which ever one it is, only Putin can answer that. But I personally believe NATO has a lot to answer for here.

      • Graven

        In addition to what John Smith said above, when NATO was expanding eastwards, Russia too wanted to join, but was denied. The people in the State Department & Pentagon didn’t wanna have to re-design all their policies based on the new geopolitical realities. Also, Russian designs on Georgia began after that, and on Ukraine after Yanukovich was ousted in one of those color revolutions

        Also, Czechoslovakia & Poland weren’t joining some anti-German military alliance, that would have put allied troops uncomfortably close to Berlin. That would be the analogy w/ Ukraine, given the distance it would be from Moscow, and even Finland, given the distance it would be from St Petersburg

        Do one of 3 things:

        ‣ Disband NATO completely
        ‣ Withdraw US from NATO
        ‣ Admit Russia into NATO

        If any of these are done, all these threats from Russia will go away, since they will no longer sense an enemy on their West. Otoh, if I were the Russian president, I’d move the government to somewhere in the deep middle of the country, such as Tobolsk or Krasnoyarsk, so that the capital wouldn’t be so dangerously close to the borders Like Ctesiphon was for the Sassanids or even Moscow during WWII

        • Russia never met the requirements of NATO. And most likely it would have used NATO membership to undermine any defense against Russian violence if they had been granted membership.

          And the idea that Russia being turned down for NATO membership means it had the right to invade Georgia is mistaken, Ukraine was also turned down for NATO membership; they didn’t respond by invading Moldova.

          And again–NATO is a *defensive* alliance–they have never invaded Russia, nor threatened to invade. NATO is not a threat to Russia.

          And why, after Russia has invaded Georgia and Ukraine, should NATO either be forced to shut down or to allow the invader in? And why should the US be forced to leave NATO if they also don’t want Russia to invade their neighbors? What is the logic here?

          Then, I think you are confused–Russia did not invade all of eastern Europe because of the existence of NATO; instead, NATO was founded in 1949 primarily *because* Russia had invaded half of Europe.

          Did Russia consider Estonia and Czechoslovakia to be enemies on their west? I think not, Stalin just recognized that these nations were weak–just what Putin thought about Ukraine.

  6. So, if Turkey becomes a full voting member of the EU, all illegal migrants currently in Turkey would get a free ride into the European mainland. Others can walk into Europe via Turkey.

    And as a large Muslim majority nation, it will have a big say in the affairs of the European Parliament.

    Clever, very clever, Mr Erdogan.

    • The Turkey of Kemal thought of Turkey as a European country. That’s not true about Erdogan’s Turkey today: they see themselves as successors of the Ottoman empire, and they romanticize Turkic empires from the Middle Ages, such as the Qhwarezmids, Timurides and Mughals

      I don’t see any European country doing a thing to stop Turks from walking into Europe today, so Turkey doesn’t even need to get admission into the EU. Also, we’ve seen how different EU countries have been frustrated w/ Brussels, and Britain in fact pulled out. Is Turkey gonna abide by those excessive EU regulations? I think they’re more likely to continue to do their own thing & ignore EU rules, while continuing to benefit from the open borders

      A sensible EU would consider their application a non-starter, but “sensible” is the one of the last things that can be used to describe the EU

      • Islam is such a chronic disease that even Ataturk couldn’t make Turks fully secular, and once an Islamist leader came to power, Islamic ideology raised again and took over the land. As someone who is from the cesspool called the Middle East, I tell you, there is no real cure of Islam. We are doomed to this until end of day.

    • Yes–it would leave Europe open to unlimited Muslim immigration. Europe would soon cease to exist in all but the geographical sense. One of the few smart things Europe has done is keep Turkey out of the EU. I hope they stand tough.

  7. Turkey vows to back Sweden in NATO, if the EU accepts Turkey as a member
    …………………………………..

    I hope Europe does not kowtow to this blackmail. Turkey should never have been part of NATO.

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