What is the problem here? All perfectly Koranic and legal. Ohh that is right!! We are not under Sharia law just yet.

The ultimate plague upon mankind: Islam!!!

Posted by: Zathras at June 15, 2006 6:33 AM

A simple message to Al-Turki and the rest of Colorado's "Saudi community", PLEASE GO HOME! Your religion and its accompaning pathologies are not compatable with our culture and are an unwanted intrusion,annoyance and burden to our well being. If you don't like being profiled stop being a potential threat. I and many others are sick of your countinous provocations and disregard for our laws and our very lives. Further more we are sick and tired of your braying on and on about being victims when you get caught red-handed.Murder,rape and theft make me angry, I have no sympathy for your cries, when that is what you and your religion condones. Muslims of your ilk are unwanted intruders, parasites, you are whiny,indolent, uninvited guest. Got that? Good, have a nice day and go away.

Posted by: abdulalshirk at June 15, 2006 7:40 AM

They say it is custom and all that religious rubbish, the truth is that Islam is not a real religion, it is a fake religion concocted years after the paedophile died or whatever STD he caught off his wives, men friends or camels. It is not legitimate, everything that they do, however wicked is justified by their "religion".

No more, they can follow their religion all they want, if it extends outside their private lives or affects the freedoms of others then it ceases to be a religion and it becomes an excuse.

Posted by: IceDragon at June 15, 2006 7:49 AM

I was once invovled in a case very similar to this one. Every possible pressure, from the Saudis, will be put on the DA's office, local press, and anyone from the Indonesian government who might represent the maid's interests. If there is any way that Al Turki can get bail, he will jump it, with help from the Saudi embassy. They go into full attack mode when these cases occur. The local Muslim community will be called to testify on his defense, proclaiming that the maid had been treated as one of the family, that they had seen her pull a large amount of money from her purse, and that they were on hand when she received expensive gifts from her employers. The fact that the maid might also be a Muslim won't help a bit. Arab Muslims are always more important than lowly Muslims from Asia; that's the Muslim pecking order in plain sight for anyone to see. One place where the maid probably won't get help from is the Dept. of Labor. They will claim that her contract was signed outside of the US, so they have no control over the fact that she was paid almost nothing. If he is convicted, intense pressure for lesser sentencing will happen. Yes, slavery does exist in the Gulf States and throughout the Muslim world. The real people to blame here are those at the US State Dept. They know exactly what goes on in the US homes of Gulf Arab countries' diplomats, businessmen and students who bring their maids with them on a visa. Best wishes to the poor victim, the maid. Chances are she will deported soon after the case. Her visa is most likely to have expired and the State Dept. doesn't really want her around. If she did get to stay, she might someday establish an organization to erradicate slavery in the US. Calling Naseem: Do you dare comment on this case? The Arabs routinely abuse citizens from Pakistan who they employ. The Pakistanis know this and secretly hate the Arabs for the abuse they put up with...and yet, it's all about the smell of money, isn't it?

Posted by: maryrose at June 15, 2006 7:49 AM

I hope she sues the death cultists for hundreds of millions of dollars.

Posted by: moderationist at June 15, 2006 7:59 AM

So has not even 1 muslim has condemed the treatment of this "slave"?

Posted by: Berf at June 15, 2006 8:18 AM

Berf:

So has not even 1 muslim has condemed the treatment of this "slave"?

Posted by: Jesus Christ Supercop at June 15, 2006 8:38 AM

Good post, maryrose. I will be waiting, too, to see if Naseem responds in any way. I won't hold my breath.

OT, but this is something I notice a lot. The "World" page of today's "am-ny" (which is a free hand-out for commuters in NYC, owned, I believe by the New York Times)has four main articles and 4 small sidebar briefs. Of those eight, seven have Islam & terror as their subjects.

To get the real impact of it, you'd have to see the page itself. A .pdf file (too large to put here) can be downloaded at:

http://www.amny.com/

This situation is true quite frequently. I keep wondering what world those screaming "Islamaphobic" are living in. There is such a stubborn refusal to connect-the-dots (as Hugh would say).

Posted by: Vee at June 15, 2006 9:02 AM

Such cases come to light every year or so in
England. It always goes like this:

A Thai or Filipino or some other Asian woman manages to escape from her Saudi, Kuwaiti, or other Gulf Arab employer, from a luxurious house or apartment on Park Lane, Cadogan Gardens or even, far more rarely, from some country estate. There is an item, or maybe three, about the girl, in the London papers. She tells of how she was beaten, of how all her papers were taken away, of how she was punished by her Arab masters, who would do such things as make her clean the toilet with her tongue if they deemed her very bad. Often she would have bruises all over, as the police would report. The names and addresses of her Saudi, Kuwaiti, or other Gulf Arab masters would be published in the paper. One would assume that they would be forever humiliated, shunned, for their bestial behavior.

And then? And then absolute silence. One does not know if the case came to trial. One does not know what high-priced lawyers were involved. One does not know what airplane contracts were threatened with cancellation, so as to involve British officials intervening on the side of -- the Arab masters. And then those Arab masters disppear.

Perhaps some in England, reading this, will recall a case or two. Perhapos someone, somewhere -- the Anti-Slavery Society -- will have more information on how the hirelngs of the Western world, whether in or out of govenrment, do the bidding of their Arab masters, to protect these particular Arab masters.

Ayaan Hirsi Ali, who should now, has stated that slavery still exists in Saudi Arabia. Officially it was abolished, under Westeren pressure, in 1962. Unofficially, of course, slavery or slave-like conditions (what is the difference: if one is treated as a slave, lives under the conditions of a slave, then one is a slave) has long been a feature of life in Muslim countries, an honored feature. From the slave soldiers, the institution of the Mamelukes, to the domestic slaves whom Muhammad, uswa hasana, took (at this point Muslim apologists will quickly interject: but he treated them so well! He was such a kind master!) -- and since Muhammad is a Model of the Perfect Man, and since slavery as an institution is recognized and therefore legitimized by its appearance in the Qur'an and the Hadith, slavery -- as a leading Saudi cleric said just last year -- can never be abolished from Islam.

Those Muslim groups defending this Saudi in Colorado have a point. Islam is, in a sense, also being attacked -- the letter and spirit of Islam, which recognizes, for all time, the instiututuion of slavery. Even if this Indonesian girl was not officially a slave, unofficially she of course was. She could not leave, for they had her papers. She had no money. They did with her what they will.

Does anyone doubt, by the way, what goes on behind the high walls of those endless palaces all over Jiddah and Riyadh and the other places where those fabulously rich beneificiaries of the greatest unearned wealth in human history, lead their fabulously decadent lives? Or for that matter, what goes on in those villas in Marbella, or on the Riviera, or on those yachts, out to which the Western call-girls are ferried, or sometimes, simply driven right on, when the yachts are in port?

Posted by: Hugh at June 15, 2006 9:45 AM

maryrose said:

"One place where the maid probably won't get help from is the Dept. of Labor. They will claim that her contract was signed outside of the US, so they have no control over the fact that she was paid almost nothing."

Perhaps, but it appears that Al Turki also publicly stated the following:

"In an interview with a Denver television station, Al Turki said there was ‘no doubt’ he was innocent. His lawyers have filed documents in his defence stating “there are Saudi Arabian customs regarding a host family’s retention of funds for their domestic servant until she leaves their service.” This, they say, explains why the housemaid was apparently paid so little."

Regardless of where the contract originated, by Al Turki's own words he inadvertantly admitted that she is due quite a sum of compensation upon leaving his service.

Posted by: miira at June 15, 2006 10:33 AM

I have a simple message for the commenter on this message board and people alike.

When you stop invading the Muslim country and enforcing crap and failed laws of your own society, the Muslims will be happy to leave your smelly pork filled environments and move back to their own nation without boarders.

You people are cancer to this planet and the Muslims are the cure. Your weeping and emotional cry's are going unheard.

You pig filth is being spread in the Muslim country so instead of cleaning the filth from our own countries which you bring with you we decided to tackle the problem from its source the US.

Listen up you red necks and pink raw pork, sort your selves out or else we will sort you all out, for free.

Posted by: Khalid Bin Waleed at June 15, 2006 10:59 AM

Hugh said

Or for that matter, what goes on in those villas in Marbella, or on the Riviera, or on those yachts, out to which the Western call-girls are ferried, or sometimes, simply driven right on, when the yachts are in port?

At first I agreed with Hugh's suggestion in another posting, that security officials ought to be logging and photographing these limos pulling up to the ferry with the call-girls. That sort of information might come in very handy, in a J. Edgar sort of way. But then I remembered, this is Islam. There is nothing morally wrong with "temporary marriages". Their wives (plural) might not like it, but they are powerless to confront their husbands. When their religious belief system justifies murder, thievery, slavery, and prostitution, it makes it hard to pressure them with blackmail. Plus they've got the money to hire lawyers to make this disappear.

Good for Colorado for not dropping the case.

Posted by: special_guest at June 15, 2006 11:28 AM

Khalid,
Are we feeling a little hostility on a lovely Thursday morning? Seriously bro, If we retract those offensive Western imposed laws,(examples would be nice) I'm sure you can do without our cash as well. Other than the oil kingdoms, which Muslim nations can feed their own without assistance?

Posted by: We need G.C. Scott at June 15, 2006 11:50 AM

Well golly Khalid,

If all it will take for folks like you to return to Moville is for us to stop invading Muslim countries, then I think we should bring our troops home this afternoon.

And how soon could you then be winging your way eastward?

Posted by: PRCS at June 15, 2006 11:55 AM

A few things pop up if one Googles Saudi + slavery. (There are, by the way, near three million hits for that search.)

One finds, for example that

A leading Saudi government cleric and author of the country's religious curriculum believes Islam advocates slavery.

"Slavery is a part of Islam," says Sheik Saleh Al-Fawzan, according to the independent Saudi Information Agency, or SIA.

In a lecture recorded on tape by SIA, the sheik said, "Slavery is part of jihad, and jihad will remain as long there is Islam."

His religious books are used to teach 5 million Saudi students, both within the country and abroad, including the United States.

Slavery is a part of Islam

One finds, for instance, that the US State Department caused one prosecution to fail:

The Saudi princess [sic] who pushed her Indonesian maid down a flight of stairs in Orlando achieved some notoriety, but the case fizzled because State refused to give a visa to the victim—she had traveled back to Indonesia to attend her mother's funeral—who was scheduled to testify in the criminal trial.

Saudi Slavery in America

And there's this on the exploitation and abuse of migrant workers in the "kingdom" from Human Rights Watch:

“It was like a bad dream” is the way one migrant worker from the Philippines summed up his experiences in Saudi Arabia. Another worker, from Bangladesh, told us: “I slept many nights beside the road and spent many days without food. It was a painful life. I could not explain that life.” A woman in a village in India, whose son was beheaded following a secret trial, could only say this: “We have no more tears, our tears have all dried up.” She deferred to her husband to provide the account of their son’s imprisonment and execution in Jeddah.

Exploitation and Abuse of Migrant Workers in Saudi Arabia

Let's be frank. With Saudi Arabia one is dealing with the most Islamic, hence most primitive, country in the world. Abuse of human rights is rampant. That phrase beloved of the media "our friends the Saudis" is obscene.

Posted by: Yojimbo at June 15, 2006 12:12 PM

Hey Al-Turki. You're a big brave guy. When your sorry fanny gets out of jail, you should be sent to your victim's family to clean their house

Posted by: MP at June 15, 2006 1:19 PM

Heh ... that guest book is filling up rapidly.

Posted by: Kristopher at June 15, 2006 1:29 PM

I really hope the authorities checked out thier friends too. If they knew about it or participated in slave swapping or human trafficking.

Posted by: squire at June 15, 2006 1:30 PM

From the introduction to this story, above: "That's the Qur'an, An-Nisa 24, sura 4:24."

What does that first "24" signify? I thought the Koran was broken down only by sura:aya.

Posted by: Television at June 15, 2006 1:48 PM

Oh, and I really should have linked to at least ONE of those am-ny stories. Seems Hamas is having to go to the rich Islamic lands to hand-carry cash back to keep the unpaid civil servant's revolt under control.

http://www.amny.com/news/nationworld/wire/sns-ap-palestinians-foreign-minister,0,3254305.story

'GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip -- Palestinian Foreign Minister Mahmoud Zahar, who has been seeking to raise money for the financially strapped government, returned to the Gaza Strip on Wednesday with a suitcase full of cash, Palestinians officials said.

An official said Zahar was believed to be carrying up to $20 million.

Israel and Western donors have demanded that Hamas renounce violence and recognize Israel's right to exist as a condition for restoring the aid. Hamas, which is sworn to Israel's destruction, has rejected the calls and instead turned to Arab and Muslim countries for help.

The source of Zahar's money wasn't immediately known. During his recent trip, Zahar traveled to Indonesia, Malaysia, Brunei, China, Pakistan, Iran and Egypt.'

The squeeze is on....

Posted by: Vee at June 15, 2006 1:49 PM

How dare they not allow him to practice his religion as he sees fit? Everyone knows that Islam permits slavery, and that Mohammed had many slaves and concubines which he got from his caravan raids and war. This man should be allowed to raid caravans too, or at least rob truckstops in accordance with his religion's teachings.
(Sarcasm off.)

Posted by: Bohemond_1069 at June 15, 2006 2:28 PM

Television,

Nisa (Women) is the name of Sura (Chapter) 4.
In listing a verse, sometimes people say (e.g.) Sura 4:24, and sometimes they say (e.g.) ayah (verse) 4:24.

Yojimbo, thanks for the links.

Posted by: Archimedes at June 15, 2006 2:30 PM

I recommend a wonderful book by a young black Sudnese woman named Mende Nazar. It is entitled (appropriately) "Slave." It is her story of how she and other children in her Sudanese village were kidnapped, raped (she was eight years old at the time), and sold as slaves by and to wealthy Arab Sudanese. (Most of the adults in her village were slaughtered.) This happened as recently as the early 1990s in her case. She was eventually sent to London to be a slave for her owner's sister, and the story of how she was brutalized and how she eventually escaped is fascinating and horrifying. Interestingly, Nazar, like many of these poor Asian slaves, is a Muslim herself, but to the Arab Sudenese Muslims, her blackness made that irrelevant. The book is available on Amazon and in many bookstores.

Posted by: kaffirchick at June 15, 2006 4:38 PM

Khalid Bin Waleed, interesting choice for a sign on name, big time islamic hero “the sword of allah” to us a simple murderer, nothing special, no real contribution to humanity, much like your posts.

Allahs so called soldiers fight for a false god. We Americans fight for freedom, interesting enough not our own. We have been free for several hundred years. We fight to set others free, our choice, we are all volunteers. We can’t free you zealots, you’re blinded by false beliefs and the rambles of a false prophet. If your god had any real power I wouldn’t be able to post, he can’t even stop my fingers. Rage on my friend, grow a real set, stop this on line jihad, be a real mujahid, join up go to iraq face real men. If you survive by all means come back, I’ll buy you a beer and really listen to what you have to say. Unlike you I have been there and back and can tell you allahs so called soldiers are getting the crap stomped out of them. They don’t die bravely with smiles on their faces, looking up to heaven, they die horribly, screaming, crying and twitching in the dirt. At least they attempted to fight with more than a keyboard. Join them.

Posted by: Ronin at June 15, 2006 5:35 PM

Well put. I would have said something less subtle, such as - why would Khalid Bin Jaild detest pork so much, after all it would remind him of his mother.

Posted by: anti-uffe at June 15, 2006 5:59 PM

Dear Muslims,

I make this oath before the Elder Gods of my pagan forefathers. I will be an implaccable foe to Islam and the goals of Islam. I will fight Islam and their followers with all of the weapons of Western Democracy and all of the strength and passion that flows through my blood.

I will not rest, until the threat of Islam to my people, is no more. I will not rest, until I am sure that my children and future generations will live under Sharia law. I will not rest until I am sure, that my religion will not perish at the hands of damned dirty Muslims.

I now offer you, the chance to leave Islam, before the cancer of Islam consumes your soul...

Posted by: skald at June 15, 2006 6:33 PM

I'm hungry. I think I will go buy some pork rinds. I'll crunch them in honor of our recent "guest" today.

Posted by: Kafir Nonbeliever at June 15, 2006 6:33 PM

And one other thing, your religion isn't the only religion to have 'martyrdom' and an end times. I will see you at Ragnarok...

Posted by: skald at June 15, 2006 6:35 PM

What Muslims do not understand is rather simple. There is a morality that transcends the malicious, malevolent, self-serving and perfidious will of Gods...

There are actually two morality. One is Objective Moralti and the other is common human decency.

Muslims, answer the following question. Does God (Allah) command something because it is moral or is it moral because God (Allah) commands it?

Another question. What does God (Allah) get out of worship and violence?

Posted by: skald at June 15, 2006 7:07 PM

skald, if they possessed the ability to think for themselves and make rational choices they would not be muslims.

Posted by: Ronin at June 15, 2006 7:12 PM

Ronin, very damn true. They seemingly have no tradition of theology and ethics. All they care about is scriptual interpretation and Law. It is a crying shame, I feel sorry for these people. Utterly sorry.

And what is more, they have the nerve to say that they have knowledge of God and arrogant enough to say they are doing Allah's will.

Me, I am a militant agnostic; I don't know and by god neither do you. Hell, even scripture and psychotic episodes doesn't constitute knowledge...

Posted by: skald at June 15, 2006 7:45 PM

Khalid Bin Waleed,
Don't you have a building somewhere to crash a plane into?

Posted by: Provoslavni at June 15, 2006 9:20 PM

.... unless Khalid been on Weed is just being tongue in cheek!

Posted by: Provoslavni at June 15, 2006 9:38 PM

Khalid Bin Waleed said, "Listen up you red necks and pink raw pork, sort your selves out or else we will sort you all out, for free."

Golly gee whiz, that sounds like a direct personal threat. I'm scared, I better go put on my brown pants.

Posted by: Pelayo at June 15, 2006 10:29 PM

Islam is a crime against humanity. And so is calling it a 'religion.'

Posted by: pythagoras at June 15, 2006 11:23 PM

Yo, Khalid Bin Waleed,
So glad you could join us. Now you listen and listen good, I am so sick of your kind and your endless hectoring on how immoral the West is. I had your kind attempt Da'wa and all I ever heard was this crap. Well listen up good, many Westerners are not promiscuouis, beer swilling, decedent pigs. Many of your con-religionst are rank hypocites, the Muslim world is a mire of sexual pathology and hypocrisy, so on that count piss off. So sick of your pompous juvenille slander and rhetoric of faux moral superiority.

Secondly we are not invaders in the Muslim world, your kind started the war. From the earliest days of the Muhammed, the ummah was expanded by never ending countinous war. Your kind invaded North Afica, Southern Europe, India,Asia Minor,and Central Asia.Egypt, Turkey, Syria, Palestine, Lebanon, Northern Cyprus, and many other places where stolen by the followers of Muhammed, so why don't Muslims get the hell off stolen Christian land? Be careful who you can cancerous. Islam is one the viliest, blackiest forces for evil ever to befall humankind. Infidels end up occuping Muslim lands, because Muslims are bunch of insolent children in need of supervision.

You call what supposed send into your world " Pig filth", well let me say that Islam isn't exactly a gift I want. It is sort of like getting shingles or the clap. So there have nice day, and enjoy this bit of intereligious dialogue and don't let the door hit you on the way out. Enjoy the Seventh Century, fool.

Posted by: abdulalshirk at June 16, 2006 2:20 AM

Corrections:
Should read- "be careful who you call cancerous"
Sorry!

Posted by: abdulalshirk at June 16, 2006 2:24 AM

Correction two, it sould read You call what we suppossedly send into your world, "Pig Filth"
Sorry

Posted by: abdulalshirk at June 16, 2006 7:33 AM

Message to Khalid ibn al-Walid:
you and your comrades conquered Israel and other countries back in the fourth decade of the seventh century. Now, you should follow your own principle and take your comrades home with you back to Arabia. Yes, you can clear the Arab-Muslims out of Israel [both sides of the Jordan], Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Persia, Mesopotamia, etc. If you want the Amerluques to go home, then you too should go home. Arabia has all the amenities now. You don't have to conquer civilized countries anymore to get those civilized amenities. You can buy them. God knows, you have enough mezumah for that. Bye. Shalom v'lo lehitra'ot!

Posted by: Eliyahu at June 16, 2006 7:36 AM

Khalid-

Weren't you supposed to be at a pillow fight in Tel Aviv?

Posted by: profitsbeard at June 16, 2006 10:41 PM

After reading all the comments of this man's supporters, including his daughter, I now see what the problem is with Muslims:

They are all hopelessly illiterate.

Can't a single one speak and write English?

You may think I'm just trying to be cute with this little off-topic diatribe, but I believe it is futile to debate or even to attempt to communicate with those who have absolutely no facility for language.

I mean, jeez, can any of you read that crap? Like Oprah, I have a hard time getting my mind around all that drivel.

The capacity for ordered thought is directly proportionate to one's skill with language, and I'm here to tell you these people are incapable of much thinking.

Posted by: Haid Dasalami at June 16, 2006 11:59 PM

So Muhammad began seizing their herds and their property bit by bit. He conquered home by home. The Messenger took some of its people captive, including Safiyah and her two cousins. The Prophet chose Safiyah for himself. When Dihyah protested, wanting to keep Safiyah for himself, the Apostle traded for Safiyah by giving Dihyah her two cousins. The women of Khaybar were distributed among the Muslims.
--- Ishaq:511

Would the State of Colorado dare to trample the religious traditions of Islam? Gonna be some pissed Moslems out there in the Mountain State. Maybe they can bring in Professor Churchill to negotiate a lasting peace.

Posted by: Alarmed Pig Farmer at June 18, 2006 11:15 PM